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« Self deception & rationalization in Omaha and Denver | Main | Missouri's Prop B Supporters not out of the woods yet »

November 03, 2010

Comments

Randy

One of the factors overlooken by those who opposed these changes is that there are consequences felt by urban communities throughout the country resulting from these rural areas where growing puppies is more of a commercial issue then an animal welfare issue.

These results are felt in areas as far away as south Florida as many of the puppies being sold in pet stores throughout that area end up in South Florida and other rescue networks across the country.

The issue of whether rescue will now need to move up the process of taking in breeders dogs as they try to get down to that magic number is probably along with the logic of TNR for feral cats.

What you end up with is a huge increase in rescue dogs from puppy mills who at least now altered and no longer able to continue producing more puppies that end up in our shelter system.

It should be obvious that doing nothing to control the number of puppies being produced and thus little or no standards hasn't worked. Will this work? Only time will tell.

Brent

Randy - I have some thoughts on this very topic and I hope you'll come back and read tomorrow because I'd love to see your feedback. I honestly don't have a fully-thought-out stance on it, just thoughts at this point.

I agree that doing nothing should never have been considered an option...just not sure this was even close to the best solution.

Alexandria Dolceamore

hahahaha! our food doesnt come from america, please, the food grown in the heart land goes to feed the livestock that will be senselessly slaughtered. the american farmer gets slighted just like the rest of us working for minimum wage. and if they stopped growing food to sell to the murderers, theyd eventually be able to go back to having regular farms, and people would get their food directly from them, instead of the farmer being the low man on to totem pole. but its all money for everyone, even the meek farmer.

all in all, this issue has nothing to do with our food, or farmers. it has to do with people seeing life as dollar signs. and people in rural areas (not all, there are great people everywhere!) dont care about animals, this is how they know how to make money and thats what they want to keep doing.


and btw MY food doesnt come from them, i dont take part in the cruelty trade, and i buy my produce locally.

gh32

Kansas City and Saint Louis sways every election against the way the rest of the state votes.I believe they should either just vote on city ordinances or be given to Kansas and Illinois,the latter would make me very happy as I hate those two cities.

Dianne in DC

Big Agri campaigned pretty hard against this measure, so the breakdown is not surprising. I am surprised that it was that close. Must be a lot of hatred towards HSUS and that guy Pacelle. Do we have a corresponding map that shows where the puppy mills are?

michael albrecht

to all the puppy mill owners, screw you, get a real job and stop profiting off the suffering of animals.

chuck

You all think this is about puppies? This is about more than puppies. Yes mills will be shut down, but so will kennels, local farmers, ranches, chicken farmers, turkey farmers, etc. Just because puppy mills in Florida and other places in the states mistreat animals does not mean it is done everywhere. Where do you think the beef, chicken, pork, and other products come from that you eat? FARMERS! And now that the humane society has their foot in the door NO ONE in the agricultural field will be able to produce meat or even make a living! There are going to be so many jobs lost from this. The things that you are so used to eating everyday (beef, pork, chicken) are going to be so expensive you won't be able to buy it! Just like what happened in California with the chicken farmers. Eggs are so expensive there its outrageous!!! All you people in big cities need to wake up and see what you have now done!

chuck

And Alexandria Dolceamore? Have you never been into a grocery store?! There is so much meat and produce in there to feed an army! Most of the food produced does go to feed America! All of the fopd items in the store are made from things farmers produce!!! Popcorn, cereal, etc. Some corn and other things mixed with that make the feed that is fed to cattle, but that is once a day for normal farmers!! Horses and cattle eat hay and grass the rest of the time! You obviously live in a big city to not know this or you dont pay attention to how your food is produced!

calico

Finally a small victory for the animals! Anyone who breeds dogs in this number, then ships them en masse to big petshops, is not a "good breeder" in my book. There's nothing good about keeping females pregnant back-to-back and then shooting her the moment she stops making litters. Or a dog whose entire life is basically in rabbit cage, outdoors in all temps, almost always on a metal mesh floor.

I am puzzled why a few people seem to think by ending dog abuse it'll somehow close down family-farm turkey producers in another area? Has big-ag got people so paranoid they're terrified that ANY improvement in animal welfare, no matter how small, will spell the end for civilization as we know it??

jardizzone

I LOVE rural area's. I LOVE Animals! I think it is possible to have common ground. Farming or raising livestock for food IS NOT the same as running Puppy Mills! The FACT IS, that it's the people IN THE urban/city area's that are buying the puppies. That MUST STOP! NO EXCUSES!! Your NOT helping the problem by buy that dog. ADOPT from a shelter, go to a rescue STOP kidding yourself and everyone else. Believe me, I live in a "Urban area" and I promise you it is NOT the answer to this issue.

Roberta Beach

I now expect all those who voted for Prop. B to be willing, able and ready to adopt/foster several puppy mill dogs, as the rescues, shelters and pounds will not be able to take them all in. I would like to see accurate data maintained of the number of dogs who are shipped out of state to other mills or destroyed :(. I particularly expect HSUS to put its money where its mouth was, using its resources and talent to now follow through on their amendment - which won't take effect for a year. Are you up to it, Wayne?

candace

Adopt from a rescue? They also buy their puppies and dogs from "puppy mills". I heard that last week rescues spent about $20000 in one weekend buying "puppymill" dogs. I had just read an article that compared the term "puppy mill" to the N word. I had not thought of it that way. But, the word "puppy mill" is a derogitory term that lumps a group of people together no matter the size of their breeding facility or the level of care. Not all dog breeders abuse their dogs. Now it is illegal to close them inside for the night! This proposition was poorly written!

What about shelters? Not sure why they don't need to provide the same level of care.

Brent

Dianna -- there is no corresponding map of where the commercial breeders are located -- or not that I know of.

Calico -- I don't know of anyone who things dog abuse should be allowed to go on. The bigger question is whether or not Prop B addressed any of the issues that allowed abused to go on. And in a state where we can't even shut down unlicensed operations, or inspect licensed ones, the reality that Prop B did nothing to create better enforcement I'm inclined to think it won't be helpful.

Roberta -- i agree, but don't recommend you hold your breath on the issue.

Candace -- agree on all fronts.

kmk

Wow, there are some angry people here! Dog breeding didn't used to be considered criminal activity. I don't get that.

I do find it interesting people think it's wrong to breed dogs for pets, but it's okay to raise cattle, swine, and chickens to kill and eat. Whatever. The HSUS is after your prime rib as well.

Candace - you're wondering why shelters don't have to provide the same level of care. Because the animal rights people are like congress - they exempted themselves. And the Missouri Humane Society's main shelter on Macklind Road doesn't have "unfettered access to the outdoors".

Diana, here is a link to the MO Dept. of Ag's web site, and there's a map that shows the counties/districts for which each state inspector is responsible. This will pretty much tell you where the high concentrations of kennels are, which is in rural areas where land prices are less expensive. There are about 1450 total commercial kennels, but the inspectors are also responsible for rescues, shelters, boarding kennels, pet sitters, pet stores, brokers, and carriers (pet transport).

http://mda.mo.gov/animals/pdf/acfa_fieldstaff.pdf

For example, look at District 9 (inspector is Lennie Clayton). He has four counties, which would indicate a high concentration of commercial kennels, compared to say, Gary Jones (District 4) who has 11 counties, including the Kansas City area.

Much of the land south of the river in Missouri tends to be rocky Ozark terrain, with the exception of extreme western Missouri, which was native prairie at one time, and the bootheel, which is bottom land and you'll actually find cotton in the bootheel.

The land north of the river was glaciated and is expensive farmland so you'll notice the inspectors have more counties, as people are growing corn and soybeans. There are commercial breeders in these areas, though. It's just a lower concentration per county.

District 8, which is Hickory County all by its lonesome, has a vacant position. I'm not sure Hickory county has all that many kennels. My guess is they're phasing it out and will combine Hickory with another district. I could swear we used to have 14 inspectors total.

I thought I had a USDA map of some sort that listed breeders by county but so far I can't find it. If I find it I will post it.

Mary Frances

What happens to the dogs that over the 50 limit? Will HSUS be taking them in? Not likely...

With their past record in support of animal control killing (less than 1/2 of 1% of donations is used to help homeless pets as USED on tv ads...its fraud and worse)

Thurgood Marshall, the supreme court justice quote applies, "What is the quality of your intent?"

Mary Frances

I wrote too fast.

meant to say... What happens to the dogs that are over the 50 dog limit allowed by Prop B?

Will HSUS be using their own substantial hoarded donations to help assist in rescues?

The Thurgood Marshall quote applies to HSUS now...HSUS "What is the quality of your intent?"

With HSUS' track record its looking bad for the animals.

kmk

Mary Frances - the proposition reads, "50 BREEDING dogs" (emphasis mine). Michael Markarian with HSUS told me to my face they had determined 50 was an acceptable number of dogs for breeders to care for.

However, the Little Missy Brigade of animal rights activists published a "fact sheet" that stated dogs would NOT be killed and the breeders could keep all of their dogs as long as they only had 50 breeding dogs. So, you can have 750 dogs if 700 of them are speutered. Yea, I know, my head hurts as well.

Is HSUS going to assist in rescues? I sure hope not - in my opinion, the dogs will be dead for sure. Vicki Hearn said it best, "Humane societies save dogs at the end of a gun barrel". It seems like every time some humane society was involved in "saving" dogs from dogfighters the dogs ended up dead - until the Mike Vick dogs came along, which is a whole 'nuther fiasco.

Humane societies have been killing pit bulls for so long I'm surprised there are any left. Now I guess they're going to start on the foo-foo dogs.

Randy

Candace, I've bought "puppy mill" dogs at auction - doesn't mean it wasn't a rescue effort. All of those dogs were rescued from being future breeders held in cages for the rest of their lives.

Many of the dogs I have bought from breeders who were "finished" with them had never lived outside of a kennel cage environment. We're talking about dogs who were several years old and never had an opportunity to be someone's pet.

Hopefully there will be thousands of dogs "freed" from capitivy if this law is enforced. People who are sympathetic to mass breeders probably thing child prostitutionj should be legal too and those who choose to profit off the suffering of those children shouldn't be limited by laws either.

Hopefully, in time, those who exploit the innocent will face a day of reckoning with our creator.

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